dell Thailand Posted : 2,903 | 6 Oct 2019 at 10.08

Bilko you are totally wrong. Thai immigration was quite happy to accept a letter from the Embassy but after a new man at the top arrived he changed the goalposts putting an unnecessary workload on the Embassies and the Embassies rejected the new rule. Every year i get a certified copy from the UK Government pensions stating my annual income and the Embassy confirmed the letter and Immigration accepted it. This in itself should have been enough

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RalphRat United States Posted : 3,771 | 5 Oct 2019 at 20.10

There were 73,000 foreigners on retirement visas in 2017? Say it is 80,000 now and each spends 1 million THB per year, both numbers probably optimistic, totaling 80 billion THB per year. That is 2.5% of the government budget, or .57% of GDP. You might be more important to your local pub, but the country doesn't need any of you.

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bop Lao Peoples Republic | 6 Oct 2019 at 16.32

I can confirm my family of three all following my retirement visa, we spend about 100K baht per month.

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believeme Zimbabwe | 6 Oct 2019 at 09.10

RalphRat is wrong. The consulate stopped notarizing income verification forms. That doesn't mean Thai immigration doesn't accept them. Also, its got nothing to do with anyone lying. It's about forcing expats to have enough money in a foreign bank account to require them to file tax returns.

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Kaicaan Thailand Posted : 18 | 5 Oct 2019 at 13.55

Niels Colov arranging clubs for expats. I would urge all expats to avoid this guy like the plague, just google him and you will see who he really is.

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Franken Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 10.53

Upon arrival X-Factor clubs are a very valuable source for people trying to figure their way. Also people need to understand in their own language what their requirements are to live peacefully in the Kingdom. Niels Club is not about any of that. One company in particular their visa company insisted that my passport was in violation when in fact it fully was not. They are just hustling for customers. Never go to their meetings. In Pattaya Pattaya City expense Club is a much better alternative if you must associate with other English-speaking person. In 12 years here I have gone to five Pattaya City expat club meetings.

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bilko Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 08.13

Kaicaan Here in lies the main problem with many expats who choose to live in Thailand they have no intention of integrating with local Thais only remaining in their own tight little circle being "imported" from where ever they originate from. Admittedly in Bangkok and Pattaya etc this may be difficult however those of use who choose to live and integrate in rural Thailand know exactly the wonderful experience you are missing out on.

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brycspain Thailand Posted : 407 | 5 Oct 2019 at 12.40

It was my understanding that the US embassy no longer validates monthly income for the purpose of retirement visas.

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LennyJ Australia | 6 Oct 2019 at 11.52

Bilko it is imperative that people go to their relevant Immigration offices. Due to the grey mess the current laws regarding retire visas. Each Immigration office has a degree of autonomy to interpret the rules and you will see this in the dog's breakfast - Thaivisa forum. The problem gets further compounded by the employees and many offices are in the dark and cannot make clear decisions. I was fortunate enough to start up a very good relationship with my local manager who had trouble understanding "Investment return", "superannuation" and "pension" all meant the same endless bucket of money. We now enjoy a comfortable relationship.

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RalphRat United States | 6 Oct 2019 at 11.45

Yo Bilko - I have previously seen that the decision of the US embassy to stop rubber-stamping silly forms (lap long) that people fill-out themselves and the embassy has no way of verifying, was a result of communications between the American embassy AND Thai immigration. My understanding is that it was a joint decision, both that the US Embassy would stop stamping such forms and Thai immigration would stop accepting them. I have no specific info about any embassy's actions other than the American Embassy, which should be of no concern to you as a Brit.

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RalphRat United States | 6 Oct 2019 at 10.46

Yo Bilko - I believe the requirement is to have had the money there for 90 days, not 2 months.

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RalphRat United States | 6 Oct 2019 at 10.45

Yo Bilko - I am not sure about how this whole subject affects Brits. I have only commented about the US embassy and their dealings with Thai immigration.

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bilko Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 08.38

LennyJ Please inform the rest of us where your immigration office is. The three that I have dealt with during my stay in Thailand would only accept a letter from ones embassy as proof of finances. However as I have chosen never to take this route but transfer the money annually in one lump sum I have never pursued this monthly payment system. This information is of no use to me but may benefit others who are at the moment struggling with this problem.

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bilko Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 08.30

brycspan Really think you are being misinformed or are misunderstanding the system. On bank account references it is very simple two copies of your bank account book (usual in Thailand) showing that you have 400 or 800 thousand baht deposited in your PERSONAL account (not joint) for a period of two months prior to a visa application plus a letter from your bank (usually costs 200 baht) stating you are a customer and do have the money deposited and when it was deposited. Plus one has to show a "money movement" on your account on the day of visa application.I have been doing this for the past 16 years and never experienced any problems.

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bilko Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 08.18

RalphRat Completely wrong if ones embassy is still prepared to issue these letters of accreditation immigration are still happy to accept them. However the US the UK and many other embassies no longer issue these letters which for once cannot be laid at immigration door but fairly and squarely at the door of the individual embassy.

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RalphRat United States | 5 Oct 2019 at 20.46

They never did "validate" anything. They simply charged $75 to put a stamp on a form that people filled-out themselves. They NEVER checked or verified ANYTHING, and believe it or not, some Americans actually LIED!!!!! (That is right, NathanW!!!!!) That is why immigration no longer accepts such forms.

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LennyJ Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 20.00

5555! - brycspain! - some clown doesn't like what you and I posted!. Make sure you ask your Immigration office. They have a degree of autonomy and could give you some minor variation - - And the clown that doesn't like our posts - Care to elaborate on your negative attitude?

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brycspain Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 15.09

So you can take a Thai bank statement showing the deposits and that is acceptable?

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LennyJ Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 14.44

True. Go to your local Immigration office and see what they want. Mine simply wants to see stamped and signed statements, showing income from an external source. I transfer 65,000 baht each month from my source in Australia and they are happy to see that.

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Ewan666 Finland Posted : 10 | 5 Oct 2019 at 11.05

Take the hint. Get out your are not welcome, hello? If I were Thai I would be more concerned about the destruction of exports and tourism and the growing gap between rich and poor.

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Bavarian Thailand Posted : 102 | 5 Oct 2019 at 09.02

The suffering Brit is just one man in a big story of a lack of appreciation and respect towards expats who have been living in Thailand for decades. Although the big majority lives here without any criminal record and contributes to Thailand and their families no one of us has collected "brownie points" in our host country, on the contrary. Harassment like the TM 30 nonsense-paper shows the view of Immigration authorities - they treat us like applicants and show no mercy. The days of warm hospitality have vanished. And so will a lot of thousands of expats who cannot afford living in the country they have once loved!

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RalphRat United States | 6 Oct 2019 at 10.48

Yo Bilko - I believe Dante used to live here and got pitched out for some reason he has not shared with us.

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bilko Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 08.41

Dante1000 Utter anti Thai nonsense as you permanently live in GERMANY how on earth would you have access to such information. or even the true costs of living in Thailand - Pure and simple trolling!!

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Dante1000 Germany | 5 Oct 2019 at 20.38

I can assure you that hundreds of thousands of foreigners who can quite well afford to live in Thailand are fed up as well with this bizarre country and its military government and will vanish too, or did and do already.

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buster Thailand Posted : 2,200 | 5 Oct 2019 at 08.32

Jugglers, political jugglers in Europe who don't give a hood about the ones who build up their country caused havoc with their single currency toy, leaving millions on the brink of collapse, homeless or addicted even in their own country. I have less but enough adjust and make the best out of life.....we all should do the same!

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kbamfield Thailand Posted : 127 | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.56

In the case of meeting the requirements for Visa extension then one size does not fit all. For example if you are married then the money required in the bank is approximately 50% less than a single guy or someone shacking up with the GF. Hows that? If you own your own condo or house then no need to pay rent as opposed to the renter and so less money is needed per month per year. This is not accounted for in the equation for meeting Visa extension of stay. Many parts of the extension of stay visa need to be looked at as some of the earlier retirees are grandfathered into approx 200,000 per year requirement. Electricity water food alcohol up

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flpatbkk Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 09.48

The grandfather rule requires one to be resident in Thailand consistently since 1998, 21 years. I'm sure that there are not to many that meet that criteria, or even know about it. ANd owning your condo/house does not eliminate a monthly payment as their is a mortgage, condo fees, etc. required. I do agree that 65,000/month is a little ridiculous as my monthly expenses here never go over 25,000 including rent, utilities, food, transport, etc.

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Kanaka45 Thailand Posted : 1,003 | 5 Oct 2019 at 06.10

The Rise before the Fall......patience people. When, not if, China falls, it will drag Thailand and this Sino dependent economy down with it. Just look at the world economic outlook. China has tens of thousands empty apartments/condos yet they were buying condos in Thailand by the droves. The Chinese were hedging on an economic problems at home and looking for foreign investments abroad. The key word is “we’re”. Notice the downtrend in condo sales here in Thailand lately ? Economic slow down has tighten everyone’s purse strings.

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Chumphon Thailand Posted : 2,831 | 4 Oct 2019 at 22.05

The suffering Brits should remember that GB once before went through economic dire strait. The lady PM at that time suggested all Brits put part of spendable income and small savings into durable food items, such as tinned cans, dried or frozen food. These were the best investments available to protect from looming high inflation and better than any savings rate. Remember? Coming to Thailand for retirement with the very minimum not able to put up 800'000 Baht or even more was a very bad idea and not the fault of Thailand.

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kaleevala United States Posted : 875 | 4 Oct 2019 at 20.44

My Thai wife and I were going to retire in Thailand, but not now. She said she would rather stay in Florida

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Gomer Antigua And Barbuda | 4 Oct 2019 at 21.55

Elias Lönnrot would advise that the Sampo is neither in Thailand nor Florida.

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flpatbkk Thailand Posted : 2,680 | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.48

Maxey is in for a hell of a shock when he finds out that you can no longer combine bank deposits with income to satisfy the financial obligation of 800,000 baht/year. I checked this out in my last visa trip and the regulations no longer offer this option. It's 65,000 a month in a Thai bank monthly or 800,000 on deposit in a Thai bank, 400,000 for those married to a Thai or here since 1998.

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farangnoi Thailand Posted : 632 | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.45

65,000 a month is a ridiculous amount for the minimum requirement. I know it is easy to go through but it is possible to live on a lot less. I could understand this if the minimum wage for a local was nearer that amount. Even at the Thai immigration for families arrrving they say 40,000 per family or 20,000 a person. Maybe they should increase those amounts to 65,000 a person and see what it does for tourism.

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icy82 Australia | 6 Oct 2019 at 15.54

meanwhile, clowns like Ewan666 are stuck here......one can only laugh.

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Ewan666 Finland | 5 Oct 2019 at 19.55

Then why the F do you stay here? The world is a big place and there are many many better places than Thailand. Thailand is heading to be on par with Laos within a decade. Why do you think the military is arming up? To protect themselves from the people when the sh-1-t hits the fan.

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flpatbkk Thailand Posted : 2,680 | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.41

Has anyone else noticed that Thai banks are now taking "withholding taxes" out of interest being paid on the new Thai regulation forcing deposits to be held in Thai banks? Next step is to declare our "income" taxable and make us file tax returns even though, as retirees, we are not allowed to work or have income or remuneration while on a "retirement (not a) Visa).Since Thais don't, or won't, pay income tax let's get the foreigners to prop up the country!

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LennyJ Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 14.55

I have not seen that. I shopped my 800,000 bit back to Aus (better interest) and transfer in the minimum 65K every month

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flpatbkk Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 09.49

@ralphrat-They are only taxing the interest, not the principle. I bet that's next!

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RalphRat United States | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.22

Well, if they are taking withholding out of it, then it is being taxed now unless you are willing to file a tax return to get it back.

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RalphRat United States Posted : 3,771 | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.32

Actually, from 2004 to 2007, the rate was a lot higher than 60, as it was over 75 for part of that time.

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farangnoi Thailand Posted : 632 | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.01

When I arrived in Thailand the Thai Baht was 24.95 to 1 USD. The financial crisis that crippled the Thai Baht made everyone assume it was cheap here. However the prices of everything has gone up drastically since the start and demise of the Thakins era. In Thailand the way of life is going to have to change a lot for everyone, even the locals. People will have to learn that they can not afford to eat out everyday. For those expats that like drinking beer all day. I advise you all move to Vietnam where beer is cheaper than water. I gave up drinking a few years ago. Many things Western people like to eat are much more expensive here already.

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salbrecht | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.32

When I was traveling to Thailand during 1968-197x, the exchange rate to the USD was fixed at ฿20/$. It is true that everything here was far less expensive then. The typical 5 or 6 meals per day was ฿30-40. Get a grip folks, everything is more expensive EVERYWHERE. Stop complaining that you don’t have enough money. It’s your fault you didn’t have the foresight to save for retirement while you had a job. That said, I do agree that ALL of the immigration requirements are targeted at getting expats out of the country. I have been here longer than most of the politicians have been alive. They can go elsewhere.

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RalphRat United States | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.24

Yo Martin - The THB was pegged at 25 to a $ prior to late 1997. Awhile before that, the peg was 20.

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Kanaka45 Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 06.13

Probably meant 34.95 per dollar.

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globaloz Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 05.21

I can remember 30 Baht to the AUD, halcyon days, needless to say I wont be coming as often any more

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farangnoi Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 00.00

@MartinN in the early months of 1995 when I first arrived here.

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MartinN Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 22.07

Farangnoi, when was that? 24.95 sounds like you’ve lost something in your evaluation unless you’re from the very distant unrecorded past. Please enlighten me.

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Worldexpat Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 20.38

The same pattern can be expected in every SE Asian destination. If you aren’t planning for much higher inflation than your homeland and for currency cost increases then you have problems.

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ReneCM Thailand Posted : 107 | 4 Oct 2019 at 15.55

I think together with me, many people their concern is to not be entirely worried about the current visa situation but the thought that it could change again in the future, putting you out, you lost all the years invested in building friendships, a network, perhaps a business, real estate. It would be even harder to start again in 10 years than today, making one consider alternative options. I would have had residence in most countries after all these years already.

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globaloz Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 05.22

Could have had citizenship.

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DaveKnows United States Posted : 491 | 4 Oct 2019 at 15.53

It is not about exchange rates. We loved and contributed to Thailand, and got this non-reciprocal immigration treatment in return. None of my friends will ever go back to Thailand now. Thailand uprooted and disrupted our lives, unnecessarily (callously, and unfairly). It will remain for Thailand to join the 21st century community of nations and conduct itself with reciprocity for the new generation of expats -- if any -- in view of the hundreds of thousands of Thais who live as expats in other countries, with green cards or the equivalent full civil and property rights. No reciprocity is going to mean no further business with Thailand.

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DaveKnows United States | 5 Oct 2019 at 18.22

Outlander, not hard, as there are over 300,000 Thais who already have green cards in the U.S. A Thai friend of mine got hers by postal MAIL, literally(!), as she was a college student in Kansas and there were no nearby consulates at the time. She never had to appear in person during the application! Purely amazing, and quite different from how I was treated in Thailand! Reciprocity should be the only "policy" that is acceptable.

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salbrecht | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.37

Outlander ... your question can best be answered by any of the tens of thousands of Thais living in Los Angeles, Las Vegas, Lowell Massachusetts, San Jose California, and many many other cities. I’m fairly certain it is infinitely easier than a foreigner getting a resident permit here in Thailand.

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mrexpat United Kingdom | 4 Oct 2019 at 18.34

Outlander, Thailand is a 'high risk' country! Can not blame other countries for thais corruption

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Outlander Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 16.50

How difficult is it for a Thai to get a visa or green card for the U.S. ?

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missy55555 Thailand Posted : 973 | 4 Oct 2019 at 15.06

This exactly why I am leaving Thailand after new year, when I have put all my affairs in order. I am going to live in Vietnam, where I can buy a house in MY name.. So much less hassle for Visas, and no nonsense about 800, thai baht or its equivalent... Cost of living is less than Thailand, so BYE BYE TM30 and the rest of the gobbledegook.

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icy82 Australia | 6 Oct 2019 at 15.55

Lol you will be complaining in Vietnam, that I am 1,000% sure of....

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bilko Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 08.45

missy5555 Sorry but you are in for a nasty shock. I have been there done it and got the "T" shirt. However good luck with your dreams of utopia!

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LennyJ Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 15.13

Ralph - Russia is a socialist country. not communist - learn the difference. China does not have a problem with Islamic - ask them!

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RalphRat United States | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.29

Yo Lenny - Guess you have never heard of China or Russia (Chechnya). Both are Communist and have fundamentalist Islamic terrorist groups problems. Why don't you give-up?

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Anu_Suwari Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.48

@LennyJ, it was a joke... @misssy's insistence that ISIS has infiltrated the southern insurgent groups amuses me.

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LennyJ Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.21

Anu a fundamentalist Islamic terrorist group has almost no chance in a communist country. - No chance

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.03

I hope there is an English language newspaper available so that you can make moronic comments to a new audience, and not haunt this place after leaving, like Dante does.

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Anu_Suwari Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 16.18

Are you sure there's no ISIS presence in Vietnam?

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Franken Thailand Posted : 303 | 4 Oct 2019 at 14.53

Google Neils Colov. Add to his name phrases like scam artist or fraudster. Just upset that he does not have as many new people as before to use.

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kenny66 Malta Posted : 294 | 4 Oct 2019 at 14.22

The Thai baht strength is one thing , stingy badly run Uk is another. The Uk has one of the worst state pensions in the developed world Fact. When people retire they want stability, want permanent status, want to be part of the community. I was here when it was fairly inexpensive, but now I find Europe cheaper, me, my wife and fam soon leave thailand for a new life in the canaries villa and pool and garden low bills and wow my money goes further

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LennyJ Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 15.02

The rat is more irritating than a blowfly on a hot day!. It's time he "left the building"

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globaloz Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 05.26

Only one question mark required Ralph.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.05

You were in the UK long enough to get a pension, but not long enough to learn the grammar and punctuation of the language???????

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mg1960 Thailand Posted : 237 | 4 Oct 2019 at 13.38

Hey Ralphrat, You sure are judgmental to other people that have not reached financially your status. Who are you to judge them or anyone? Perhaps you should heed my mothers advice to me. Try walking in someone's else's shoes for awhile so you can understand where their coming from. I guess you have little empathy for people different from you.

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LennyJ Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.18

mg1960 just ignore it. he's a "brave" keyboard warrior but - be careful if you come across him in real life. He told me he knows Origami or something once!

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PeterLPT Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 15.15

The best thing to do is to ignore "Ralphrat". He is just here to heat up things with an IQ less than a 5 years old child.

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flpatbkk Thailand Posted : 2,680 | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.19

"Another route is to have income and deposits totaling 800,000 baht combined". This rule has been discontinued. It's 400,000-800,000 in a Thai bank account or 65,000/month deposited in a Thai bank from foreign sources. You can no longer combine income + deposit to make up the 800,000. And no information regarding whether the 65,000 has to be kept untouched or can be used for monthly expenses has ever been issued despite numerous request for clarification.

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icy82 Australia | 6 Oct 2019 at 15.58

No, I am not that stupid to share my life story online.....you're not the sharpest tool in the shed are ya?

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LennyJ Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 20.04

Yep Icky - at least I have a life> do you hide yours for a reason?

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.35

Life story again Len....

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LennyJ Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.15

I sent my 800,000 back to Australia. I bring in 65,100 every month. My wife and I live very comfortably on that. you can spend all of that 65,000 each month if you wish. All my Immigration office want to see is an annual, signed and stamped bank statement with 65000 coming in EVERY SINGLE MONTH - (not 130,000 baht every 2 months). That is my instruction from MY immigration office. If you want to do that go to yours and ask them.. What can only be described as Thai logic is - If you are single you need 65,000. If you are married to a thai, you need 40,000!

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benno Thailand Posted : 1,118 | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.16

We spend money only on what we really need. Not go out,no new clothes, nothing except daily stuff to life. The rest we send back to Europe . Taking money out seems a good thing to us until we leave for an other better ,safer,welcoming,easier country with clear rule of law ,cleaner in so many ways... I think most of U have no idea whats going on on "thai" social media. OMG, i give it to april-mai the latest before a bigger impact will hit NEW-Old Siam. Ciao soon ,Thailand-Thaitanic.

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Konajake Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 16.35

Anus insights . I,m sure people care ( on Thai social media )

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Anu_Suwari Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 16.21

@Konajake, it's not that you don't care, it's that you don't understand Thai which is the reason you "don't care what's going on in Thai social media". This is also precisely the reason you have no clue regarding public sentiment or know much about the country at all.... except what happens in your little expat bubble on the BP. Good luck with that!

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Konajake Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 15.21

Promises promises . I don’t care what’s going on in thai social media

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stewie Thailand Posted : 2,526 | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.16

Downward spiral for expats since 2014 when the military took over IMO, draconian laws targeting expats, high inflation and the high baht. We are not wanted it seems, us that spend our money in the country supporting Thai family's and Thai businesses, we cant just move on, but they don't give a rats bottom, we know to mut.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.09

The inflation spike was caused by Yingluck's attempt to buy enough votes with the rice pledging and increased minimum wage to get amnesty for her criminal brother. It had nothing to do with the coup.

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Konajake Thailand Posted : 5,082 | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.11

With extreme import taxes people pay more than most western countries do . I was amazed how cheap and plentiful things were when I visited a Costco wholesaler .Thailands economy would explode overnight with that repressive tax gone .You want o attract better tourists that the zero dollar tours ? Try uping your game and recycling and consevation .Instead of elephant riding have elephant sanctauries . Instead of drugged out tigers for pics have tiger rehabilation centers . Instead of cutting every last tree down try planting some . Tourists would probably pay you to do it for you .Wake up

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salbrecht | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.45

Konajake ... I would also add the following to your list. Stop wasting billions of baht on the useless military; fake bomb detectors, submarines, an aircraft carrier with no aircraft, an unnecessary Navy mansion on the river, etc. etc.

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MartinN Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 21.46

For once, you almost make sense.

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BJK Thailand Posted : 14 | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.45

I moved to Thailand 30 years ago and couldn't see all this coming. So I suppose I must be stupid.

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RalphRat United States | 5 Oct 2019 at 19.47

Starting about 1995, an astute person would have started becoming concerned at the drop-off in foreign reserves, as the BOT bought THB to hold the 25 to a USD peg. By 1997, an astute person would have been borrowing as much money as they could in THB and converting it to gold or some foreign currency. In late 1997 or early 1998, they would have converted back to THB, paid off the loans and would have an amount of profit comparable to the initial loan amount, having doubled the value as measured in THB.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.28

30 years ago, I don't think many foresaw the floating of the THB in late 1997. Don't be too hard on yourself.

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icy82 Australia Posted : 1,485 | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.45

Who cares about the stupid foreign pensioners here? Judging by their horrible attitudes on these boards, they do not deserve to be here. To hell with them, and I hope they vacate Thailand asap!!!

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icy82 Australia | 6 Oct 2019 at 16.00

Btw Lenny, it's "bad-mouthed".

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icy82 Australia | 6 Oct 2019 at 15.59

You are wrong Lenny, don't forget that I am smarter than you.

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bilko Thailand | 6 Oct 2019 at 08.55

Dysotopia2 I have a question. After all your years of "academic" teaching and educational experience why is it you are not occupying a 'chair' in some prestigious university instead of wasting your time trying to teach "dumb" (your words not mine) Thai students for by your own admission you are really far to a superior person to be doing this.

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LennyJ Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 20.22

I'm not wrong Icky. You're just a bad-mouth Bogan from the poorest part of Sydney and an embarrassment to the rest of us Aussies

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bilko Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.53

Dysotopia2 With a self declared 'superior' attitude such as yours is it really any wonder "Falangs" are not liked by many Thais. As for your comment on meeting "intelligent Thai academics" sorry but I would put it another way most academics THINK they are superior to the rest of us - very wrong I have in my 81 years only ever met a handful of academics with a grain of common sense or "intelligence" no matter what pieces of paper they wave about!

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.37

Kon, perhaps you can spell attitude correctly before trying to put me down.....no comment here on trains or cars? Shock, horror, gasp....

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.35

Unig, hahahaha what a superlative comment! Well done champ!

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.19

Lenny, lol like you can speak. You don't know anything about me and guess what mate.....YOU ARE WRONG!!!

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.17

Dystopia, also who cares about your so-called "disdain towards many so-called educated Thais". Do you think Thais care about your opinions in their country? No I don't think so. The only opinion that matters is their opinions TOWARDS YOUR KIND!

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.16

Barman, ha yeh good luck with that old codger...

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MartinN Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 21.58

Well, we have been @Nuked and Iced, well and truly! The carry of the truth and the documentation of the truth is compelling, quite simply, they must be some superior being, I did not write (human) before being, or the followers of Thainess.

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Unig Malaysia | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.09

@Dystopia2: If you have yet to meet a so-called intelligent Thai academic with two worthwhile brain cells to rub together, have you wonder maybe it's because they have been taught by some subpar Canuck self-proclaimed university lecturer for 20+ years?

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LennyJ Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.04

Dystopia just ignore Icky. He's just a bad-mouth Bogan from the poorest part of Sydney and an embarrassment to the rest of us Aussies

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PauliZ Antarctica | 4 Oct 2019 at 18.19

I hope you vacate Thailand soon too. Go back to Aussie Land and run over some more Kangaroos. Good bye, mate!

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Dystopia2 Canada | 4 Oct 2019 at 17.00

Well then icy, you're even worse. You've drunk the cool-aid and gone native in you blind love of all things Thai.

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icy82 Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 16.27

Funny thing is, Dystopia2, I am not Thai...

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Dystopia2 Canada | 4 Oct 2019 at 15.56

Thai posters like you, nuke1786 and Unig simply reinforce Farang disdain towards many so-called educated Thais. Your blatant xenophobia and arrogance just makes us have more contempt for you. In 20+ years of teaching uni here, I've yet to meet a so-called intelligent Thai academic with two worthwhile brain cells to rub together. You're simply in the same moronic category.

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nuke1786 Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 14.05

(continue) The truth is that they are NO better than Thais, and any evolutional path will come and be determined from within, definitely not inspired by some sort of epiphanies of a glib Larry King-wannabe with a mordant tongue. I am damned sure about it. And for those ungracious guests, knock yourself out with this one: why did you come here if hometown is soothing, guarded by God? Give me a break... Having said it all, here is my THUMBUP for you, man.

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nuke1786 Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 14.04

Uh, judging the blatantly acerbic tone assumed, I can’t absolutely take your vitriolic stand against all the farangs in here, but you are dead-on at one point manifested by a certain chunk of farang population in here: the lack of RESPECT to Thai sociopolitical culture, be that as major as congress elections, or as trivial as the arrest of pickpocket in the airport. For almost anything, these keyboard warriors seem to be able to find, from high and low, subtle flaws and throw thunders at them like they are from God’s kingdom or Mars.

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tomb Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.29

Don't feed the trolls.

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Konajake Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.07

We all just aspire to have as shiny an atitutde as you Icy82

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SamJones Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.34

Now here's a Thai apologist and moron, all in one

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barman Viet Nam | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.30

I hope that you vacate this earth very soon. I am sure that with your attitude there are many people who would assist in that process.

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Dante1000 Germany | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.30

Yes, mein Führer, we do. Führer befiehl!, wir folgen. Hahahahaha.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.29

icy82 - Even though I am one of them, I am not offended by your comments, and agree with you! I gave you a thumbs-up!

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BillyRubin France Posted : 2,197 | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.28

The value of a currency is fixed by the privately owned central bank that illegally controls the money flow in the country, any country. For details look into Eustace Mullins research that concentrates on the Federal Reserve and Bank of England but applies to every country excepting N Korea, Iran, and Syria. Or cling to your illusions, your choice.

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bkkmatt United Kingdom | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.53

For once in a while I fully concur with Billys comments. IF people would just find the time to research and turn off the TV, radio and newspapers who share the same one sided narrative then people would realise the world is nothing like they think it is. The monetary system is one worth studying.

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ubuntu Thailand Posted : 2,655 | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.27

A Thai doctor salary at a government hospital is 30,000 baht yet retirees need to transfer 65,000 baht into a Thai bank each month and thus incur about 20,000 baht in transfer fees alone every year` Many expats own their own condos bought in cash thus have very low living expenses. Thai logic = Good people have 65000 baht/month. Numerous criminals have lots of money also. My wealthy professional friends have already left Thailand fed up with all the hassles and twisted logic.

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AJT Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 07.02

I don't know about doctors, but I do know about people of means. They are not living in Thailand full or partime because of living costs etc. They are not moving out en masse, but many are seriously considering it and I personally now know three prominent individuals that have sold their properties and left within the last two months. Why? Generally the response has been along these lines: "I don't need hassles. What for? I am tired of the politics, the corruption. Not worth it. And then I look at my view from the 40th floor and what do I see? Pollution. I ask myself why am I staying here? And I can no longer find a good answer."

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jimster Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 23.06

Mr expat Cambodia has an equivalent of Tm30 and they intend to enforce it more strictly.

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LennyJ Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 19.00

Kenn Couple that with a site called X-RATES, an international multi-currency live comparison and you can pick an optimum time to bring money in. You can "test transferwise to pick the right time. They hold and given rate for 3 days when you look at them

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mrexpat United Kingdom | 4 Oct 2019 at 18.18

Come to Cambodia, no tm30, no reporting, no money in bank, no visa runs, no apologists , actually i do not know any other country in the world where expats defend the country to such extremes, I wonder why? If you want to reitre its very easy

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KennPeters Denmark | 4 Oct 2019 at 13.36

Use transferwise. Cheaper:-)

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barman Viet Nam | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.34

Thai government officials from the top to the bottom are ignorant and racist and that will never change. Pity Thailand was never colonized. It would have taught them honesty, truth and decency.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.31

I believe the minimum for a doctor starting at a government hospital after government sponsored school is about 40,000 per month for a GP. It is higher for specialists.

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Dystopia2 Canada Posted : 211 | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.17

I think the strength of the Baht is only part of the problem and may not be the main part. I earn Baht. So, I'm not really affected as much by the appreciation like others. But, the cost of living here has skyrocketed in the last decade, especially the cost of groceries. But, salaries have not increased at all. Most importantly, the hostile environment towards Farang (visa, TM30, 90-day etc.) makes living here difficult. It's ironic that a Communist country like Vietnam is much easier place to live for foreigners than Thailand. The bottom line is the Vietnamese powers-that-be want us there and the Thai elite want us gone.

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bilko Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 11.04

Dysotopia2 Love your version of utopia especially where Vietnam is concerned. I suspect you have never actually lived or worked in Vietnam other than possibly as a tourist. However I have worked for their state petroleum company and lived there for three years. It is still a very much communist run police state. and not the utopia many such as you dream of. Visas required in advance to move from one district to another even on state programs. With constant personal surveillance by the police. However be my guest follow your "dream". However one huge plus Vietnam does know how to attract and look after tourists of that there is no doubt.

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digival France | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.49

Since 1976 consumer prices index made x5 . In touristic area lot more x10 for accommodation . Everything now is quoted on stock market globalized , everything is produced with energy so oil market affect all prices , The 2008 financial crisis ; everyone paying the banks rescue , the financial system at your expense . . Don't focus on the Kingdom that is just an emerging country , think global , financial system , ultra liberalism , that have enriched the 1% . Salary are frozen everywhere in the world .

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pjt Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.42

But was the rise in cost of living not also predictable. Thailand is no different from other countries. As they develop wages rise and costs go up. Indeed if we want those at the bottom of the income scale to be lifted out of poverty then logically the rest of us have to be prepared to pay more of things they make or grow. If you think Vietnam or anywhere else is not going to go though a similar cycle of inflation then I am sorry but I think you will be disappointed. Actually we should have seen greater cost inflation - but have avoided that at present by keeping still wages at miserably low levels for many workers

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Dystopia2 Canada | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.28

@marty1035. I lived and worked in Vietnam. True they don't have long-term visas. But, it's easy to get a visa and there's no police state checking up on where you live and no 90-day reporting. It's all about attitude and atmosphere. The Vietnamese welcome foreigners and the Thais go out of their way to be hostile. Vietnam isn't Shangri-la. But, it's light years ahead of Thailand, at the moment. For one thing, it's moving forward at breakneck speed. In contrast, Thailand is regressing to some reactionary, mythic past.

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marty1035 Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.58

except the Vietnamese don't want you there. That's why there's no long term retirement options.

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Dante1000 Germany Posted : 11,888 | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.09

I can only say that friends from Europe running a restaurant and homestay in Chiang Rai or a coffeehouse in Chiang Mai, resp., having created jobs for local people and having been very successful, are fed up with the money policy and the immigration regulations which bother them as well, and will leave the country, now that they face that Thailand will be as empty of holidaymakers as North Korea is. TL is fascist military state already. We westerners learn in school quite early what fascism is and how fascism becomes manifest, and to what fascism leads, and we say NO, thank you, bye-bye.

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.21

Lmao well said nuke1786. The super cretin called DanteFraud actually resides in ITALY and not THAILANDIA.....what a super wog lover he must be!

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nuke1786 Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 14.14

Uh... then why are you still here, poor Noble Man? My early bidden farewell here is to your later departure: Godspeed and good luck to whichever your endeavor is.

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digival France | 4 Oct 2019 at 13.09

About fascism you are fore sure a specialist , Angela have done what hitler didn't pull all European country on the knees with monetary policy , euro designed for their own economy , a slave coin , man you are so dumb ! You think that with you bar beer and guest house you raise the gdp country ? Farang business have made price raise here in tourist area ! Of course Thai must hate .

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BGC2BKK Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.22

Friends......yeah right. Sure. Your 12.000 posts in a few years time here prove you are lying, Pinnocchio1000. People with friends have better things to do.

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Ewan666 Finland | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.40

Fascism has nothing to do with it, fascist nations were quite welcoming to foreigners, as guests. Here it seems to be small minded bigotry. Or worse, that Thailand is being manipulated by anti-white globo-homo.

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MaxiRyu99 Thailand Posted : 81 | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.06

You can add TM 28 and TM 30, too as a reason for shattered EXPATS' dreams

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Renaissance Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.12

I know that I shouldn't say this, but just ignore the TM28 and TM30. Register for the TM30 so that you can send in the forms online (in 10-12 minutes) when you return from abroad, but I don't understand why foreigners are the slightest bothered by the TM30 for domestic travel. How would Immigration know that you left the province for a holiday in (Phuket)? But if you are a terrorist or criminal, then you really MUST fill in the TM30 so that Immigration knows where you are. LOL!

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mg1960 Thailand Posted : 237 | 4 Oct 2019 at 09.46

Wow, if you can't afford these requirements then you can't retire here and the government don't want you hanging around. They set the bar high for some reason in my opinion because you don't need 65,000 baht a month to live here. Even a lot of middle class Thais don't make near that.

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bkkmatt United Kingdom | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.54

Well you managed to get through immigration ok Ralph

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Renaissance Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.15

@RalphRat: Perhaps consider that one day the 800,000 and 400,000 Baht amounts will be increased. This will affect those who are not "dregs".

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Dystopia2 Canada | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.00

@RalphRat. The Thai elites are so arrogant, they simply don't realize or more to the point don't care about the huge financial contribution by expats to the economy because a good deal of that contribution is to a sector of the Thai populace (in their minds the mere hoi polloi) for whom they have little regard and who they want to keep poor and stupid. Large segments of Isaan has been transformed by expat money. But, this is actually counter to what the Thai powers want to happen because it takes control from them.

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andyabroad Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.42

Too true Ralph, you need look no further than home

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.22

They do not want the dregs coming here, for good reason. Based on most of the comments on this site, they do not set the bar high enough!

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simonthai1 Thailand Posted : 2,678 | 4 Oct 2019 at 09.31

retirement destination no 20 and falling but more about the TM30 than the currency which is hitting the poorer retirees.

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Nowhereman Thailand Posted : 118 | 4 Oct 2019 at 09.11

I used to give money to the poor around Victory Monument. But from now on let the Thai people take care of their own and I will take care of myself. No more giveaways.

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.21

Ain't you a superhero Nowhereman? Do you happen to wear a cape?

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jimster Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 08.57

The poor around Victory Monument are probably illegal Cambodian beggars you mistook for Thais. If you want to help Thais you don't give money to beggars you help out at orphanages or give money to a village chief.

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Unig Malaysia | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.40

Your 1 satang will not be missed Cheap Charlie

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marty1035 Thailand Posted : 512 | 4 Oct 2019 at 09.08

Just like the tourists, we can go elsewhere.

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Unig Malaysia | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.40

Yeah, but who wants you?

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WhizBang Thailand Posted : 6,164 | 4 Oct 2019 at 09.07

Given the economic state of Thailand, the political climate, the endemic corruption, the total lack of law enforcement, the corrupt legal system, I cannot understand how the baht continues to strengthen. Unless, of course, the powers that be are keeping it strong so they can ship tons of corrupt money off-shore.

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.22

Wrong LennyJ, I agree with all of Ralph's comments.....except for his hatred of blacks!

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LennyJ Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 18.26

bkkmatt, the Rat's knowledge is always hidden by his vitriolic, arrogant attitude. He has no friends here.

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bkkmatt United Kingdom | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.55

The arrogance of Ralph Rat is amazing considering his clear lack of knowledge on most things.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.24

Check-out a 20 year graph of Thailand's current account surplus. You probably don't understand the significance of it, so also get a big economics book and spend a few months studying it.

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Dante1000 Germany | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.16

Thailand is a money-laundering facility, that's why foreign money comes in.

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Spareme Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 09.56

You were doing okay with your comment when you said you don't understand how the baht can strengthen. Stupid speculation after that killed it.

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bop Lao Peoples Republic Posted : 414 | 4 Oct 2019 at 08.43

I'm actually enjoying the high baht and slowly sending baht back home. In 3 or 4 years I'm outa here.

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ricardo Thailand Posted : 1,323 | 4 Oct 2019 at 08.36

I can understand the frustration for him and other retirees with the Baht getting stronger by the month against all major currencies. One suggestion would be to get out of Pattaya as that is one of the more expensive cities in Thailand. Good luck good fellow but don't see the Baht weakening anytime soon.

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Renaissance Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.19

A married couple with 15 cats and all their needs taken care of + tumboon's can live on 10,000 Baht per month very, very easily in a rural setting.

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franklin Thailand Posted : 5,435 | 4 Oct 2019 at 08.34

Equally as costly are the environmental, pollution and road dangers that are never addressed and acted upon sufficiently

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LennyJ Australia | 4 Oct 2019 at 18.22

This is nothing to do with Thailand's environmental problems.

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Unig Malaysia | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.41

At yet you are still (maybe) here.

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RalphRat United States Posted : 3,771 | 4 Oct 2019 at 08.32

The GBP is a large part of the problem. It has depreciated significantly against most currencies. Remember, any exchange rate involves TWO currencies.

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bkkmatt United Kingdom | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.57

Ralph a quote of the day for you to ponder over old boy. "Better to Remain Silent and Be Thought a Fool than to Speak and Remove All Doubt"

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bikeme Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 12.34

Ewan66 - That is correct, the exchange rate difference effects primarily countries with currently poor exchange rates. The USD hasn't changed that much, but the pound sure has plummeted. Grumpy expats want to blame the current government, but it is the foreign governments and currency speculators that are causing the issue.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.34

Yo Ewan - If you read the article, the largest source of people on retirement visas is GB.

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pjt Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.31

Ewan66 - this article is using an English person as an example, and this the depreciation of sterling is very relevant. The article also shows that people from UK are largest number of retirees. RalphRat is right - the impact is a combination of both the Thai baht in relation to Thailand and your home country (or wherever your funds are coming from). The smart folks are those who understood that 60 to 70 baht to GDP would not last as due to an economic shock in Thailand and so moved their money during its recovery. BTW the UK is in long term decline even before Brexit so its currency would be expected to weaken anyway

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Ewan666 Finland | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.45

LOL what sort of logic is that. That would only affect English people. The world reserve currency is USD.

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bilko Thailand Posted : 5,083 | 4 Oct 2019 at 08.32

What an utter load of political rubbish as usual from Bloomberg.However it is true that the high value of the Baht is causing many problems and not only to expats who have retired to Thailand.The bottom line here is that many expats did not do their homework on the Thai economy before "emigrating". There has been a strong pattern here for about a decade of this situation arising.If they had bothered to look back over the 'boom & bust" years in Thailand over the past three decades there was always a strong possibility this would happen. However it is risky moving to anywhere if one only has a fixed monthly pension as a source of income.

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bilko Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 11.29

Spareme Expert or not it is called common sense.However to anyone who has only lived worked in one country all their lives and maybe gone abroad on holiday a few times this may be very hard to comprehend. When I first moved permanently to Thailand it was 70 Baht for 1 UK£. Simply looking at the history on the Baht over two previous decades it was obvious this could not be maintained. Taking the law of averages I calculated on 50 Baht to the pound and even then was way out on todays EC rate. However I was in a position financially where even this not not create any major problem for myself however I can imagine some would have serious problem

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bilko Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 11.18

Mr.Cool I wonder why after reading your comment against my post the old saying "It was not me sir, Honest" should spring to mind. When someone does not do their homework on averages (I can remember when the US$ was 4 to the £ and then dropped one US $ to the pound). Take into account the "boom and bust" of the two currencies here and a picture emerges over a period of four decades if some one calculated at a rate of around 42 Baht to the £ they would be on a reasonable footing. Bottom line many who moved to Thailand could not in reality afford to do so period.

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Mr.Cool Germany | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.41

What utter nonsense. According to you, retirees should “done their homework” and taken into account the possibility of a possible 9/11, the Gulf War, millions flooding Europe, Brexit. Did you predict the astronomical rise in rents and cost of living in Cambodia as a result of Chinese investment in less than a decade?? Even a millionaire acquaintance whose finances are largely in the hands of investment companies is suffering from the tariff war between USA / China, the continuing political quagmire of Latin America through to Brexit and the unexplained strength of the Thai Baht.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.29

Yo Spareme - It was easy to see coming. The THB was pegged at 20 to a USD for years, then 25 until it was floated in late 1997 and hit 56 briefly due to issues relating to an obviously temporary crisis. Looking at the recovery and upward trend of the current account surplus, it was easy to see coming. I moved most of what I had in the States here at exchange rates higher than 45 to the USD.

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Spareme Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.00

Question: just how many top flight economists have predicted the strong baht starting a decade ago? Exactly none, so how then can you suggest people who are not savvy about international economics could do any homework. You're clearly an expert at hindsight.

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tomb Thailand Posted : 1,713 | 4 Oct 2019 at 08.29

Why no mention of TM30 and all the other hoops Expats have to jump through? Surely this is also causing an exodus.

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icy82 Australia | 5 Oct 2019 at 10.22

Pure laziness jimster, that's what it is....

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jimster Thailand | 5 Oct 2019 at 09.13

Apply for permanent residency or citizenship then. Who lives in a country to 20-40 years without applying for at least PR if not citizenship? Besides, unlike China, Thailand actually grants citizenship to foreigners so what's stopping you all?

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Dystopia2 Canada | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.39

lungstib, agree. Even if like many expats, you've been here 20,30,40 years, bought a home, raised a family put kids through uni, contributed to the community, you're still considered a mere temporary guest unless you attempt the costly residency. I've taught uni for over 20 years, worked for the Royal Household Bureau, received a Royal decoration for service and yet, I'm still just a guest, reporting every 90 days and could be tossed out at any time.

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RalphRat United States | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.36

Yo lungstib - Correct, they do not want vagrant farangs here, and I don't blame them.

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Renaissance Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 11.21

@lungstib: That's the unfair side of the visa regulations. You could live here for 3 or more decades and then have a bad year, and you're kicked out of the country.

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lungstib Thailand | 4 Oct 2019 at 10.28

Correct. Did my hoop jumping yesterday, documents, copies and everything signed twice and if its all accepted I get an 11 month reprieve. Its like having to pass an exam EVERY year. And if the money disappears you are out of here even if you have lived here for many decades.

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